several Midi banks

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Hiccup
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Joined: Sat Mar 31, 2018 8:38 am

several Midi banks

Postby Hiccup » Tue Apr 17, 2018 5:42 pm

Hi!
I'm using the Akai MidiMix controller. This controller has special keys to switch Midi banks. But these has no effect in GStomper Studio. Of course, then these special keys are only correspondent to a tone or cc value. So, my question… is there a way to switch midi bank settings in the app with a midi key on the controller? If not, please move this question to the feature requests.
Since we are able to save the Midi settings in a file perhaps it is possible to link a key to special Midi setting files, like "go left/right" in the filename list. So it is up to the user how many bank settings he wants to use.
What do you think about this?
Greetings!
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planet-h
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Joined: Wed Jun 19, 2013 4:46 pm

Re: several Midi banks

Postby planet-h » Wed Apr 18, 2018 7:19 am

Thanks for your message, Hiccup

Hiccup wrote:Hi!
I'm using the Akai MidiMix controller. This controller has special keys to switch Midi banks. But these has no effect in GStomper Studio. Of course, then these special keys are only correspondent to a tone or cc value. So, my question… is there a way to switch midi bank settings in the app with a midi key on the controller? If not, please move this question to the feature requests.
Since we are able to save the Midi settings in a file perhaps it is possible to link a key to special Midi setting files, like "go left/right" in the filename list. So it is up to the user how many bank settings he wants to use.
What do you think about this?
Greetings!

What exactly do you want to do with the "banks".
In the MIDI world, Sounds aka presets are organized in "Programs", which can be switched by sending "program change" events.
Programs on the other hand are organized in "Banks" (each bank can contain 128 programs). Banks can be switched by sending "Bank Select" (there can be a max of 128*128 = 16384 banks).
As G-Stomper Studio uses "program change" events to switch between patterns in the pattern set, there is no use for "Banks", at least no use with a deeper sense.
If you can explain what exactly you want to do or what you want to achieve by switching banks, then we can surely discuss this further.
Hiccup
Posts: 19
Joined: Sat Mar 31, 2018 8:38 am

Re: several Midi banks

Postby Hiccup » Wed Apr 18, 2018 12:30 pm

Maybe I have not yet the practice in using Midi at all. Sorry for my stupid questions.
What I want to do is to make different controller setups. And I would like to switch between them with a key press on the controller. So, what I mean with "midi bank" is this setup of one controller set. I didn't find a solution directly on the controller. But there are this two buttons "left bank" "right bank" to virtually enlarge the range. When this is possible in GStomper Studio, please give me advice. Hopefully this was more clear to you? Thanks a lot!
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planet-h
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Re: several Midi banks

Postby planet-h » Wed Apr 18, 2018 1:01 pm

Hiccup wrote:Maybe I have not yet the practice in using Midi at all. Sorry for my stupid questions.
What I want to do is to make different controller setups. And I would like to switch between them with a key press on the controller. So, what I mean with "midi bank" is this setup of one controller set. I didn't find a solution directly on the controller. But there are this two buttons "left bank" "right bank" to virtually enlarge the range. When this is possible in GStomper Studio, please give me advice. Hopefully this was more clear to you? Thanks a lot!

It's not a stupid question at all.
What you're talking about are backs of controller elements that are located on your controller.
Let's say you have a block of 8 pads or knobs or whatever.
And this block can be used as 4 controller banks, which can be switched by pushing the bank1, bank2, bank3 or bank4 button.
In each bank, all controllers (e.g. pads) in the block can send independent events.
Let's say pad1 sends C1 in bank1, C2 in bank2, C3 in bank3, and so on.
Or if it's a controller (a slider for example), then slider1 sends CC24 in bank1, and the same slider in bank2 sends CC25 for example.
So in short, the bank selector on your controller have the only purpose to change your local controller setup. In each bank, all the controllers send their own CCxx values.
it's like having the same controller two times in your case. But these buttons do not send any midi events. These only change the controller locally.

The different controller values (in each controller bank) can all be mapped in one single setup in G-Stomper.
There is no need to change the G-Stomper setup. All you have to do is to map the different controllers in each bank to whatever you want in G-Stomper.
Hiccup
Posts: 19
Joined: Sat Mar 31, 2018 8:38 am

Re: several Midi banks

Postby Hiccup » Wed Apr 18, 2018 3:24 pm

Thank you! I think it's clear to me now. So this will not work with a controller with only one programmable bank.
Do you think, this nice function could be solved with a software hack? I'll try to explain...
The controller has several knobs, sliders and so on with different cc numbers. Every part of this is mapped in GStomper Studio and saved to a file. GStomper Studio could detect one of the buttons and switch internally to a second preset of controller mappings, like loading a different file. Then every knob, sliders and so on has a different mapping in GStomper Studio than before. With this, there is no need anymore to have expensive controllers.
So the normal mapping function of GStomper Studio is the same, but can change live with a Midi input. Do you think this is possible? I know, the other answer you can tell me is to buy more professional controllers ;)
It would be fine to get this feature in a later version. => feature request
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planet-h
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Re: several Midi banks

Postby planet-h » Wed Apr 18, 2018 3:56 pm

Hiccup wrote:Thank you! I think it's clear to me now. So this will not work with a controller with only one programmable bank.
Do you think, this nice function could be solved with a software hack? I'll try to explain...
The controller has several knobs, sliders and so on with different cc numbers. Every part of this is mapped in GStomper Studio and saved to a file. GStomper Studio could detect one of the buttons and switch internally to a second preset of controller mappings, like loading a different file. Then every knob, sliders and so on has a different mapping in GStomper Studio than before. With this, there is no need anymore to have expensive controllers.
So the normal mapping function of GStomper Studio is the same, but can change live with a Midi input. Do you think this is possible? I know, the other answer you can tell me is to buy more professional controllers ;)
It would be fine to get this feature in a later version. => feature request

Unfortunately this is not possible, as it is a typical chicken <-> egg situation.
You cannot control a midi setup with a midi controller that is mapped by the midi setup and vice versa.
That's not the way it's supposed to work.

Try to look at the "banks" as followed.
You actually have a MIDI controller with 16 mixer channel strips (or controllers for it).
But the hardware interface does only provide 8 channels.
The only thing that the bank left/right does is to scroll either to the lower (left) or upper (right) 8 channels.

It is similar to the mixer view in G-Stomper Studio.
It shows a max of 12 channels, but you have actually 36 channels.
By using the scroll (>>) button, you switch between T01-T12, T13-24, and VT01-12,

In short, the banks are for your controller only.
Just do your mappings as followed:

1. activate the left bank on your controller
2. map the sliders to the desired controls in GSS
3. activate the right bank on your controller
4. map the sliders to other controls in GSS
5. now switch between the banks to use either the the lower or upper mappings.
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planet-h
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Re: several Midi banks

Postby planet-h » Wed Apr 18, 2018 4:00 pm

Regarding other controllers...
As there are thousands of controllers, it is almost impossible to make a recommendation.
It all just depends on your personal needs.

I personally prefer controllers which can assign an individual midi channel per pad and knob, but that's only my personal taste.
Hiccup
Posts: 19
Joined: Sat Mar 31, 2018 8:38 am

Re: several Midi banks

Postby Hiccup » Thu Apr 19, 2018 10:13 pm

Ok, my idea is not practical to solve in the app. But it looks like to be programmable depends on the structure of code. Because it is an unusual way to work with midi I'll accept to live without it.
And for all with an Akai Midimix.. the buttons "left bank" and "right bank" are only useful with the software Ableton live. It seems that this bank shift is programmed in the software. The Midi signals do not change after pressing one of this buttons.
Thanks again for your helpful support and patience!
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planet-h
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Re: several Midi banks

Postby planet-h » Fri Apr 20, 2018 7:12 am

Hiccup wrote:And for all with an Akai Midimix.. It seems that this bank shift is programmed in the software. The Midi signals do not change after pressing one of this buttons.

You're right. After checking the user manual of the Akai MidiMix it seems that these bank buttons do change the controller mapping, these change as you said the mapping in the software (or in other words these just scroll the mixer in the software).

Hiccup wrote:Ok, my idea is not practical to solve in the app. But it looks like to be programmable depends on the structure of code.

It more depends on the fact if a developer is willing to implement a hack for one single controller.
It is solvable in a multi track sequencer like Ableton, Cubase, or on Android AEM and maybe in the upcoming GSC app, but in a Groovebox setup like GSS this would just mess up the complete setup, sorry.
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planet-h
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Re: several Midi banks

Postby planet-h » Fri Apr 20, 2018 2:53 pm

A maybe possible solution for G-Stomper Studio and family would be do allow multiple mapping banks while having a quick access to them through an interface inside the apps, e.g. by a new set of buttons (in the apps) to step through the defined mapping variations.
Such buttons could then theoretically be mapped (in some global way) to MIDI CC values or even to Note events.

Could you monitor in some way what exact message those bank left/bank right buttons send?

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