Samsung without 3.5mm

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SkinTex
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Joined: Tue Jun 02, 2015 6:03 pm

Samsung without 3.5mm

Postby SkinTex » Mon Aug 12, 2019 8:24 am

Last week I read something which could be a concern on the long term. A while ago, Apple removed the 3.5mm jack from it's iPhones and everyone was making fun of them. The memes were endless and everyone had a good chuckle about the silliness of thinking 3.5mm is no longer useful. Even Samsung, which made advertisements about it. Good laughs.

However, the joke seems to be on us android users now. Before announcing the newest model, that very same Samsung has been removing all references to said advertisements and it's now clear their new flagship is coming without 3.5mm jack as well.

Considering they're usually setting the example on the Android market (due to having a large share of it) it's pretty likely other companies don't want to stay behind. The result could be that in a few years, 3.5mm becomes a gimmick seen only on B-class devices and outdated devices.

I don't like it. I've got a Bluetooth (Jabra street 2) and while playing music works alright with a delay, with creating music it's a huge pain in the creative process. Imagine blowing on a flute and you hear the result 2 seconds after. Instant feedback is pretty much a necessity for me and I can only imagine the pains of Bluetooth in a live setting.

I'm already covered by having an OTG cable + a USB soundcard (native support on LineageOS), but that means no charging while stompering.

Planet-h, could this be a good time to start thinking about creating an app which enables an old phone to act as a single audio output for multiple devices? Using wifi, the speed should be alright to receive multiple streams with low latency. Having a.... "virtual mixing panel" would actually already be useful now. I struggle with the ableton link because the sounds don't come over the same speakersource, making it hard for me to tune to each other. But that might be a personal thing. Tried "Soundseeder" and a variant but that complicated things and required processing power going to ads.

Anyway, that's just a solution I can think of. Not sure if it's feasible technically or commercially. One thing is for sure; if Samsung is going without 3.5mm in the future, I'm going without Samsung in the future.

What's your opinion on this guys?
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planet-h
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Re: Samsung without 3.5mm

Postby planet-h » Mon Aug 12, 2019 8:50 am

SkinTex wrote:Planet-h, could this be a good time to start thinking about creating an app which enables an old phone to act as a single audio output for multiple devices? Using wifi, the speed should be alright to receive multiple streams with low latency. Having a.... "virtual mixing panel" would actually already be useful now. I struggle with the ableton link because the sounds don't come over the same speakersource, making it hard for me to tune to each other. But that might be a personal thing. Tried "Soundseeder" and a variant but that complicated things and required processing power going to ads.

Anyway, that's just a solution I can think of. Not sure if it's feasible technically or commercially. One thing is for sure; if Samsung is going without 3.5mm in the future, I'm going without Samsung in the future.

What's your opinion on this guys?

In short, it's technically impossible to stream multiple devices over WiFi and then mix all together in one single device while keeping the latency low.

What you need is an USB-C Y-cable. Such are widely used to listen to music while charging the device, and I'm pretty sure these will also work to have audio output while using external MIDI controllers on the USB port.
https://www.androidcentral.com/best-usb-c-headphone-adapter

The other way would be an external audio interface. There are actually many of them that are supported by Android. As far as my knowledge goes, all USB-Class-Compliant interfaces are working. Some of the IK Multimedia IRig interfaces work very well at lowest latency while being perfectly sized for mobile usage;)

Bluetooth audio is no option, at least not if you want low latency.
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planet-h
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Re: Samsung without 3.5mm

Postby planet-h » Mon Aug 12, 2019 8:58 am

Btw. it's not only Samsung who has removed the headphone jack from their devices.
Google removed the headphone jack since the release of the Pixel 2.
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planet-h
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Re: Samsung without 3.5mm

Postby planet-h » Mon Aug 12, 2019 9:31 am

SkinTex wrote:Having a.... "virtual mixing panel" would actually already be useful now. I struggle with the ableton link because the sounds don't come over the same speakersource, making it hard for me to tune to each other. But that might be a personal thing.

I agree, that mixing with different speaker sources can get very tricky.

There are two possible solutions for the problem..

1. Use a minimalistic hardware mixer. Here is an example https://www.amazon.com/DM-208E-Portable-Switchable-Channels-Microphone/dp/B07M97RV91. Such mixers are available for a price starting at 49$. Such mixers often come with headphone jack in connectors.... that way you don't need zillions of cable converters. Of course, on devices without a headphone jack, a USB-c to headphone jack adapter would be required.

2. If it must be "virtual", then a PC with a multi track low latency audio interface is required. That way you could mix the devices together in whatever software you prefer.
SkinTex
Posts: 13
Joined: Tue Jun 02, 2015 6:03 pm

Re: Samsung without 3.5mm

Postby SkinTex » Mon Aug 12, 2019 9:37 am

Oh wow. I kinda feel dumb now as I have seen you talk about a Y-cable elsewhere on the forum. Coming from kali nethunter where a OTG Y-Cable means "external USB dongle & charging", my mind didn't register its a different thing.

Nevertheless, an external audio handler should probably be the next step as I want to use multiple devices with single output.

BTW, here's the link to what I was talking about:
https://www.androidauthority.com/samsun ... s-1017246/
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planet-h
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Re: Samsung without 3.5mm

Postby planet-h » Mon Aug 12, 2019 10:04 am

SkinTex wrote:Oh wow. I kinda feel dumb now as I have seen you talk about a Y-cable elsewhere on the forum. Coming from kali nethunter where a OTG Y-Cable means "external USB dongle & charging", my mind didn't register its a different thing.

Nevertheless, an external audio handler should probably be the next step as I want to use multiple devices with single output.

For a very long time, the micro USB ports have dominated the market. And micro USB did never officially support charging and using the USB port for something else at the same time. There was even the chance to brick a device by using the wrong adapter. USB-C explicitly added that feature to its standard. But to be honest, even for myself, it took a while until I accepted the existence of such cable adapters;). How far it goes and how well it works is something that I don't know yet, as I never tried USB MIDI over such an USB dongle & charging.

SkinTex wrote:BTW, here's the link to what I was talking about:
https://www.androidauthority.com/samsun ... s-1017246/

Thanks a lot for that link. I had some great laughs while watching it .... made my Monday morning :mrgreen:
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planet-h
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Re: Samsung without 3.5mm

Postby planet-h » Tue Oct 01, 2019 4:18 pm

Btw. I meanwhile found a very well working solution to charge an USB type C equipped device while using MIDI hardware or other USB gadgets.
Check out the Delock 4 Port USB Type C Hub with and Power Delivery
(requires a device with an USB Type C connector + Android 6.0.1)

We've just published a working solution for devices with an USB Type C connector at our MIDI Info Page.

On older devices with a Micro USB connector, it is technically impossible (at least officially) to charge your device while USB hardware is connected.

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